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Thread: Items about heals

  1. #11
    Beta Player Marquess KicsitCsicska's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Valkure View Post
    The solution is to make supports more useful as hybrid, than as heal bots. So that, even with max Cauterize, they would still represent a threat.
    Agree. Supporters deserve more dmg to be useful when heals are decreased to 10%. Playing with competitive damage dealing ability is always funier that without it. They actually needed it after this heal nerf. This heal nerf is needed, because ally-heal-based items are too important and heals are generally too high (a healer can heal much more than enemy's damage in the match).
    Last edited by KicsitCsicska; 03-28-2019 at 01:25 PM.
    Thanks for reading my post!

  2. #12
    Beta Player Emperor Valkure's Avatar
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    Kicsit, we share the same view on the topic, but yet I think your suggestions are going in the wrong way. Let’s focus on one step at time. First, supports need their unnerf to become more useful. Then, after people would naturally pick them to do something else than healing bot, heal-per-sec must be lowered. If you lower heals now (or raise Cauterize), they would just become useless.
    However, this is wrong: “a healer can heal much more than enemy's damage in the match” If you’re lucky, you can heal for 200k in a long game. While there are 5 enemies dealing 100k dmg *EACH*.
    You can’t outheal dmg, especially if it’s *BURST DMG*.

  3. #13
    Member Baronet YoYtuvieja's Avatar
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    I think that cauterize its ok, I would reduce his duration to 1 second so its more easy to retreat and wait for the healing.

    The problem that affects the supports its their have a poor base kit, and their self-healing is also affected.

    In the golden age when the supports were ok, cauterize avoided that they become OP if they have a good base kit and so much healing.

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    Beta Player Knight
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    Actually the problem with supports right now is that they must flee at first blood or they are dead and if their escape ability is in cool down they are dead anyway

  5. #15
    Beta Player Emperor Valkure's Avatar
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    @YoYtuvieja: the problem is that they over-nerfed supports on dmg, mobility, hp, and then, to compensate burst meta, they ultra-buffed heals. The result is that heals still cannot compensate burst meta and that supports are shit because A BUFF TO THE HEAL-TO-OTHER IS NOT A BUFF TO THE SUPPORT, BUT TO THE TEAM. As already said in many other threads, I am a strong supporter of a nerf on heals. But before that, I must see an unnerf to everything else for supports.
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  6. #16
    Beta Player Marquess KicsitCsicska's Avatar
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    What about nerf Cauzerize without balance the general heal decreasing? E.g.:

    -Weapon shots decrease enemies heals by 20% for 1.5s by default.
    -Cauterize decreases the enemies heals by 20% more per level.

    -> The heal decreasing would be 20%-80% instead of 0%-90%

    I think it's so 'elegant', because there are only 20% scaling. There would be a better basic heal decreasing, because damage is easily can be useless against heals. And a little bit worst max heal decreasing, because the 90% decreasing totaly destroys life rip, kill to heal, inbuild selfheal and ally heals too.
    Thanks for reading my post!

  7. #17
    Member Esquire Gioker's Avatar
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    I honestly think this would buff cauterize more. They took out inbuilt cauterize from champion's decks for this reason. Nobody wants to be hit by a bunch of caut in the beginning of the match. And this would stress support players even more than they are.
    Also, champions like Inara- with Earthen guard, that increases healing received, would be favored over others- pretty much shoving the meta in one direction, or emphasizing a three tank team, where shields/ barriers are everywhere to block the caut.

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    Member Baron buoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KicsitCsicska View Post
    What about nerf Cauzerize without balance the general heal decreasing? E.g.:

    -Weapon shots decrease enemies heals by 20% for 1.5s by default.
    built in caut was just removed, for a good reason too.

  9. #19
    Beta Player Grand Prince M3RC3N4RI0's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Valkure View Post
    However, this is wrong: “a healer can heal much more than enemy's damage in the match” If you’re lucky, you can heal for 200k in a long game. While there are 5 enemies dealing 100k dmg *EACH*.
    You can’t outheal dmg, especially if it’s *BURST DMG*.
    One could try with dual healer though. With 400K heal vs 500K damage it's quite close already. Champs have skills to avoid cauterize, shields and movement abilities, so caut does not make a support useless. Even a reduced healing would not make supports useless since without healer the tank(s) cannot cap the point. Or just very slow since they must use out of combat regen to get their HP up again.

    The general problem is, that to avoid two support teams the concept of the second support was given up. Pip, Grohk and Grover once have been those 2nd supports. They were redesigned into main supports. Also potential 2nd supports like Jenos with his high damage were changed into full supports - aka luminary bot.

    What I don't understand is why 2 tank meta is fine but 2 support meta is not. The typical support tanks like Ruckus, Torvald, Barik, were not changed into pure stand-on-point main tanks. Since tanks are an unattractive class it would make sense to destroy the 2 tank meta (which just exists at ranked of course).

  10. #20
    Member Baron buoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Valkure View Post
    @YoYtuvieja: the problem is that they over-nerfed supports on dmg, mobility, hp, and then, to compensate burst meta, they ultra-buffed heals. The result is that heals still cannot compensate burst meta and that supports are shit because A BUFF TO THE HEAL-TO-OTHER IS NOT A BUFF TO THE SUPPORT, BUT TO THE TEAM. As already said in many other threads, I am a strong supporter of a nerf on heals. But before that, I must see an unnerf to everything else for supports.
    Agreed, why did they nerf hp?

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