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Thread: Easy Aim Doesn't Mean Easy Champ

  1. #31
    Beta Player Baronet HayShark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Valkure View Post
    I am perplexed. It doesn't seem to me I've ever said Alacrity is OP. What I've said it is exactly the opposite. Look in GesteYiam's thread for Lian. My words say that I have no problem with her auto-aim, but that I can understand that in low tier it is a problem, so we need a way to make it less appealing at low tier. From this, my suggestion.
    I've never said Alacrity is game breaking.
    I am also perplexed as I never mentioned you saying it was OP. But uh... I do have this quote in which you say that this particular Legendary makes her OP in low levels of play. Even if you didn't directly say Alacrity was OP, you did say that Lian with Alacrity is OP at low levels of play. Following this logic, it would be game-breaking at low levels of play via your interpretation of the term "game-breaking".

    Quote Originally Posted by Valkure View Post
    However, back to the main topic. The point here was that auto-aim on Lian is a problem only with Alacrity, which is quite abused at low tier. So, my suggestion is still the same (as in other threads): remove the bonus on cooldown Alacrity has and lower Lian's dmg when picking that LC.
    So, you can get more auto-aim, but you are spamming it less and for less dmg. This should compensate and not make her OP at low tier.
    In addition, something doesn't have to be OP to be game-breaking. For instance, I don't think I'd call a game-breaking glitch where my character continuously falls into a void "OP". While "game-breaking" isn't very clearly defined I'd loosely define it as "An aspect or issue with a game that's large enough to warrant attention and to be addressed quickly (if possible)." Probably not the best definition, but it works decent enough. It covers glitches, bugs, balance issues, various errors... pretty much anything it would need to.

    From what you've said, you think it's a problem at a low level of play. A problem strong enough to be nerfed so much that it becomes so unattractive to basically the entire playerbase that it sees little or no use.

    Quote Originally Posted by Valkure View Post
    Exactly: what I am trying to do is to remove any will to use it, for whoever has been playing for over a month.
    You think it's a large enough issue to be virtually removed from the game entirely. Like it's breaking the game at lower levels of play.

    Edit: Also, if you've said that the opposite is true ("What I've said it is exactly the opposite.") then why would you nerf something that's already underpowered? Because it's annoying to a certain group of players? That makes no sense. You either rework it, leave it alone, or buff it until it's at an equal power level for the majority of players.
    Last edited by HayShark; 04-30-2018 at 04:23 AM.

  2. #32
    Beta Player Emperor Valkure's Avatar
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    Oh, mamma! :-D :-D :-D
    Ok, I've tried my best. Seriously, discussing with you is non-sensical. You simply don't care about my reasoning or what I am trying to do, you are just analyzing word by word, trying to find... don't know, a problem?
    I shall stop to lose time in discussing with you. This is not my language: you can get my general idea and discuss on that, or you can just analyses every single word.
    First case: we will have an interesting discussion.
    Second case: you are trying to get a point while analyzing single words in a language that's not mine.

    Please, feel free to learn Italian and come back to discuss in a language where I would be the one using this stupid trick to make you feel stupid.
    Till that moment, adieu! :-*
    I've finally found it!

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    #AggressiveSupports
    I'm tired of repeating the same things, watch this: link

    "It's just Casual/ Go Ranked if you want a decent team/You are low tier, so you're bad." Rage

  3. #33
    Beta Player Baronet HayShark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Valkure View Post
    Oh, mamma! :-D :-D :-D
    Ok, I've tried my best. Seriously, discussing with you is non-sensical. You simply don't care about my reasoning or what I am trying to do
    It's hard to understand your reasoning when you insist on having Supports go even with every other class in 1v1 scenarios... or when you insist on nerfing something that's already underpowered.... If anything's non-sensical, I suppose those would fit the bill. Like, you have solid reasoning on why something is annoying or difficult to deal with. But the way of fixing it you suggest is almost always ridiculous or... ill-conceived would be the proper word here I think. Instead of proposing a nerf that makes it virtually unusable, why not propose a rework instead?

    Like, how about in order to change Alacrity to be less annoying at low levels of play but somewhat up its viability at higher levels of play we change it to further reduce the cooldown of Grace slightly, and the shot penetrates shields (or even something truly unique like penetrating through damage immunity skills such as Ice Block) instead of hitting all targets? It's harder to get inadvertent kills and deals less overall team-wide damage while adding an extra potential layer of strategy for when the skill can be used.

    You could also change it so that Grace always hits the furthest target and no longer suffers damage falloff. So now it's used as a tool to purposely snipe wounded targets attempting to mount an escape. While also slightly reducing the cooldown of Grace.

    A third potential option is to have Grace target the normal singular player and all deployables in view. With Bulldozer it could give her the potential to wipe a field of hazards, eliminate Ying clones, even deal up to 1000 damage to Vivian's 1200 health Sentinels in a single blow. Instead of inadvertently killing players, you inadvertently remove mines and other discreet deployables. Again, with the slight cooldown reduction. (This one is by far the most situational, but could be the best choice against certain team compositions.)

    I just can't get behind the backwards idea of proposing a nerf to something that's already considered quite bad to most players instead of proposing a rework. It truly makes no sense. It's not that I don't care about your reasoning, it's that I simply cannot understand how you arrive to balance-related conclusions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Valkure View Post
    you are just analyzing word by word, trying to find... don't know, a problem?
    I think that using quotes to find flaws in logic or to help illustrate a point is fine. That's part of the reason quotes exist, after all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Valkure View Post
    I shall stop to lose time in discussing with you. This is not my language: you can get my general idea and discuss on that, or you can just analyses every single word.
    First case: we will have an interesting discussion.
    Whenever I try to have an interesting discussion it usually just ends up involving insane views on how things should be balanced. Seriously, some of your views are... questionable at best. Sometimes they're alright. Other times... not so much. This is definitely one of those "not so much" times.

    Quote Originally Posted by Valkure View Post
    Second case: you are trying to get a point while analyzing single words in a language that's not mine.
    I literally spent over half of that post working backwards from your understanding of the term "game-breaking". I threw in that other definition just to clear the water a bit. Also, those "single words" are widely-understood terminology in the realm of gaming. Terms that you clearly understand like "OP". You saying something along the lines of "Lian is OP at low tier because of X" and then saying the equivalent of "I never said X was OP" is uh... I don't think that would be too heavily affected by a language barrier. Then again, the only other language I speak is Spanish and the barrier could be more drastically different.
    Last edited by HayShark; 04-30-2018 at 04:56 AM.

  4. #34
    Beta Player Emperor Valkure's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HayShark View Post
    It's hard to understand your reasoning when you insist on having Supports go even with every other class in 1v1 scenarios...
    Ok, everyone, this guy wins all! :-D :-D :-D
    Now I understand why you are quarreling with me by quibble-words, even on the "bring back sprays" thread.
    You are still angry for the fact that I don't want supports as free kills :-D :-D :-D

    As said, they were good 6 or 7 months ago and no one ever complained they were OP in dmg or similar, still they were able to defend themselves. Keep re-arranging my words in order for them to sound lame, but this would not change a single dime of what I say. And what others are able to understand, it seems.

    So, last time. I would not waste again my time on you.
    Non c'è peggior sordo di chi non vuol sentire.
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    #AggressiveSupports
    I'm tired of repeating the same things, watch this: link

    "It's just Casual/ Go Ranked if you want a decent team/You are low tier, so you're bad." Rage

  5. #35
    Banned Grand Prince
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    Quote Originally Posted by Valkure View Post
    Ok, everyone, this guy wins all! :-D :-D :-D
    Now I understand why you are quarreling with me by quibble-words, even on the "bring back sprays" thread.
    You are still angry for the fact that I don't want supports as free kills :-D :-D :-D

    As said, they were good 6 or 7 months ago and no one ever complained they were OP in dmg or similar, still they were able to defend themselves. Keep re-arranging my words in order for them to sound lame, but this would not change a single dime of what I say. And what others are able to understand, it seems.

    So, last time. I would not waste again my time on you.
    Non c'è peggior sordo di chi non vuol sentire.
    :-*
    I still get 3 to 15 kdr with jenos on a regular basis tho

  6. #36
    Beta Player Emperor Valkure's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EpplZ View Post
    I still get 3 to 15 kdr with jenos on a regular basis tho
    Because you are obviously the average player, of course. [sarcasm]
    I've finally found it!

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    #AggressiveSupports
    I'm tired of repeating the same things, watch this: link

    "It's just Casual/ Go Ranked if you want a decent team/You are low tier, so you're bad." Rage

  7. #37
    Beta Player Duke Skidt's Avatar
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    Okay, fine, but healbots and damage sponges and button mashers have no place in the game, it's just stupid.
    GIVE ME THE OLD RIPENED GOURD BACK! (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻




  8. #38
    Beta Player Esquire
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    Overwatch is (was?) the King of cheap, no-fun kills. That's why I came to Paladins.

    I left after the Devs decided that an FPS was allowed to have hit-scan no-aim skills because it was a MOBA hybrid. I'm waiting to return if they ever choose to fix Lex and Lian.

    Oh and guess what? Symmetra, the Queen of AutoAim in Overwatch is having that removed. For once, Hi-Rez, copy Overwatch .
    Last edited by FOURONESIX; 04-30-2018 at 01:10 PM.
    "Remember the days when you had to aim in an FPS? Pepperidge Farm remembers."

    #RemoveAutoAim

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