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Thread: Snipers

  1. #11
    Forum Moderator Marquess cmsaunli's Avatar
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    It's quite true that at the moment, Kinessa is a little bit strong. Pip has no chance, and she's reasonably well kitted out to be fine in close range too. I think maybe them on an even playing ground with Sha Lin is okay, perhaps rework their legendaries to not be so dumb. It's be nice to not get instantly rekt with no chance of having a chance to react.
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  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saiken62 View Post
    Cassie and sha are not snipers ffs. The only problem I have is with strix and his flare
    sniper
    ˈsnʌɪpə/Submit
    noun
    a person who shoots from a hiding place, especially accurately and at long range.

    Cassie isn't, but Sha Lin is by definition.

  3. #13
    Beta Player Knight Mukyu's Avatar
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    Snipers unlike other damage dealers have no presence on the objective, they rely on holding angles, and if they try to do so, the risk of them dieing is very high and its a suboptimal strategy.

    strix cant do that reliably, while kinessa Calibrate, Reposition and Added VFX nerfs heavly nerfed that play style, although she can reposition for new angles the best, its still suboptimal position for a sniper to be in.


    also note that snipers have the lowest winrate in the game, kinessa beeing the worst offender, and strix the lesser so i doubt snipers will be nerfed based on data which is what hi-rez usually base their changes into.

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    Beta Player Duke M3RC3N4RI0's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mukyu View Post
    also note that snipers have the lowest winrate in the game
    Not on high skill levels though.

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    Beta Player Duke MrsCrii's Avatar
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    Realistically, a sniper one shots anyone at any range, so complaining that they can do it in two is rather silly. Snipers are supposed to do the most damage per shot but be extremely vulnerable up close. This is largely the case here. Kinessa is fine, her mobility cards/talent were nerfed and she has a VFX trail to help people track her. She doesn't need any more nerfs, if anything they were overdone.

    Strix' pistol was finally nerfed, so his close range damage is fine. His mobility is terrible, but he can quick snipe better than Kinessa so it works out okay. The only problem with him is the change to his flare. Even with the range nerf it still acts as a constant Cassie ult, as even the PPL casters have admitted. That's unacceptable. If they're going to insist on his reveal being global then the area of effect and duration need further nerfing and even then Unauthorized Use combined with global reveal is completely broken. Unauthorized Use should be a self reveal only or otherwise reworked.

    Other than the reveal, though, snipers are fine. New players always complain about snipers because they fail to take cover and have poor awareness so they die to them often. People that stay at low skill levels have the same issue. Everyone else understands how to counter them.

  6. #16
    Beta Player Viscount EliteCadre's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MekaDeth View Post
    sniper
    ˈsnʌɪpə/Submit
    noun
    a person who shoots from a hiding place, especially accurately and at long range.

    Cassie isn't, but Sha Lin is by definition.
    If that's the definition of a sniper then that means I can be considered a sniper as Viktor if I shoot accurately from a hiding place and at long range, such as at the roofs in Timber Mill (The reduced damage won't matter, as long as I am holding the definition of sniper)

    When we speak of snipers in this game, we speak of champions that are relatively weak at close range, strong at long range and have a dedicated sniper weapon, aka a weapon that can do tons of damage (1000+) has no damage fall off, is hitscan, and has a scope. Sha lin may have a 1000 damage weapon with long range and no damage fall off, but it doesn't have a scope and it's not hitscan. Hence, he's not a sniper by the game's standard. In other words, although he can play like a sniper, he's not dedicated to sniping.

    Anyways, for the topic, snipers are deadly at long range, but pretty weak at close range. That means they can be easily flanked by anyone really, not just the flank champions. In this way they either die or are forced to escape and recover their health, in which they'd be wasting time that way, time that could have been spent on eliminating high value targets such as enemy healers and troublesome damage dealers. If you can't flank the sniper, then try to find cover and shoot/heal from there. In case you're a tank fighting at the point, lay down your shield and hold tight till your flank gets that sniper and/or gets suppressed by your teammates fighting alongside you at the frontlines.
    Last edited by EliteCadre; 04-26-2018 at 02:18 AM.
    "The strength of the team is each member, the strength of each member is the team..."

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    #Revert_Viktor's_Rework

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    Quote Originally Posted by EliteCadre View Post
    If that's the definition of a sniper then that means I can be considered a sniper as Viktor if I shoot accurately from a hiding place and at long range, such as at the roofs in Timber Mill (The reduced damage won't matter, as long as I am holding the definition of sniper)

    When we speak of snipers in this game, we speak of champions that are relatively weak at close range, strong at long range and have a dedicated sniper weapon, aka a weapon that can do tons of damage (1000+) has no damage fall off, is hitscan, and has a scope. Sha lin may have a 1000 damage weapon with long range and no damage fall off, but it doesn't have a scope and it's not hitscan. Hence, he's not a sniper by the game's standard. In other words, although he can play like a sniper, he's not dedicated to sniping.

    Anyways, for the topic, snipers are deadly at long range, but pretty weak at close range.
    If you choose to do that as viktor, then yes technically you are sniping. None of the snipers have weak damage at short range and that is the problem.

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    Beta Player Viscount EliteCadre's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MekaDeth View Post
    If you choose to do that as viktor, then yes technically you are sniping.
    Yeah, but still, he's not considered an actual sniper in the game. I was just citing at what sniper means in Paladins, and that the general definition of sniper that you gave doesn't apply here when we speak of snipers in Paladins.

    Quote Originally Posted by MekaDeth View Post
    None of the snipers have weak damage at short range and that is the problem.
    Well, maybe they don't have weak damage at short range, but bear in mind that it's still weaker than the damage of other non-sniper characters. For example, Kinessa's carbine cannot outdamage Viktor's rifle at close range, especially if he's using Gunnery or Firefight, and Strix's sidearm cannot outdamage Skye's wrist crossbow, and so on...
    Sometimes it's not just about damage. For example, Maeve cannot outdamage Strix's sidearm in terms of just pure weapon attacks aka just using the primary weapon. In this case she has to play it right like using combos and items like illuminate. In this way, he'll certainly die, even if he can outdamage her in terms of raw DPS.
    "The strength of the team is each member, the strength of each member is the team..."

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    #Revert_Viktor's_Rework

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by EliteCadre View Post
    Yeah, but still, he's not considered an actual sniper in the game. I was just citing at what sniper means in Paladins, and that the general definition of sniper that you gave doesn't apply here when we speak of snipers in Paladins.



    Well, maybe they don't have weak damage at short range, but bear in mind that it's still weaker than the damage of other non-sniper characters. For example, Kinessa's carbine cannot outdamage Viktor's rifle at close range, especially if he's using Gunnery or Firefight, and Strix's sidearm cannot outdamage Skye's wrist crossbow, and so on...
    Sometimes it's not just about damage. For example, Maeve cannot outdamage Strix's sidearm in terms of just pure weapon attacks aka just using the primary weapon. In this case she has to play it right like using combos and items like illuminate. In this way, he'll certainly die, even if he can outdamage her in terms of raw DPS.
    You could call Shalin a sniper, a marksman, sharp shooter, long range damage hero with projectiles, whatever, it doesn't change the fact that Shalin, Kinessa and Strix are too fucking strong right now, especially when you are going up against all three in one match and you can't even leave the spawn without being insta gibbed. It's cheesy, it's bullshit and it's gotta change.

  10. #20
    Beta Player Duke MrsCrii's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MekaDeth View Post
    You could call Shalin a sniper, a marksman, sharp shooter, long range damage hero with projectiles, whatever, it doesn't change the fact that Shalin, Kinessa and Strix are too fucking strong right now, especially when you are going up against all three in one match and you can't even leave the spawn without being insta gibbed. It's cheesy, it's bullshit and it's gotta change.
    If the enemy team takes all three of those champions and you're getting thrashed it means your team is not flanking as it should. That's how you counter snipers. Kinessa has some mobility, how much depending on talents and cards, but Strix and Sha Lin do not. Use that against them.

    There's always a counter to any champion or team composition. There are no champions that are so OP that there is nothing you can do about them.

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