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View Full Version : A few tweaks to Grover



Ironmonger42
05-17-2017, 06:01 PM
I love Support champions, but I rarely feel like Grover is the best choice. Yes, I use him. I have him at lv 9. But i've been pondering some ideas and here's what I propose:

Throwing Axe:
Damage: 400 -> 500
No longer has bonus damage

Crippling Throw:
Damage: 300 -> 200
Projectile Speed Increased

Blossom:
All allies in range of Blossom are highlighted for Grover (and only Grover)

Whirlwind:
Healing per second: 2500 -> 2000
Anti Healing cannot lower the healing from Whirlwind by more than 50% (in other words: minimum of 1000 healing per second)

Cards: Perennial
Rework: Reduces the cooldown of Blossom by 0.25/0.5/0.75/1 second for every ally healed, including Grover, by the active heal.

Legendary: Ferocity
Reworked: Throwing Axe now gains damage the farther it is thrown before making contact with a champion. Damage at max range: 1500

Legendary: Rampant Blooming
Reworked: Blossom does 35% more healing for every ally healed by Blossom, not including Grover.

This is by NO MEANS nerf.

1. He is rewarded for playing close to multiple allies, making him a good support when you have double tanks.
2. It makes his primary fire far more consistent and in some ways stronger. At close range, this is a buff. If the enemy DOES have a sniper, he can choose ferocity and get it back and then some.
3. His healing would actually be buffed both in healing amount and in cooldowns. the only real change is that he now needs to heal multiple allies, not just 1. If he does that, this is all 100% A BUFF.

Thales3002
05-17-2017, 08:43 PM
Are you seriously nerfing him? He's already the worst support on the meta due to having low damage output and a huge cooldown on a mere 1000 HP healing, and you want to nerf him? People have been asking for buffs for ages, and then I end up reading this...

The only thing I agree with in this thread is the allies glowing for you in Blossom, that would be useful.

My suggestions:

His axes' speed is increased by 10%
Blossom - Cooldown reduced from 12 to 10 seconds, passive heal increased from 80 to 100 per second
Deep roots - No longer prevents targets from being pulled or knocked back (this is more of a bug fix than a buff)
Rampant blooming - Extra healing increased from 160 to 200 per second during 4s
Ferocity - Now also increases axes' speed by 30%

Nerfing Grover the way you want to is like increasing Lex damage by 50%, it's madness

BahaisDontKill
05-17-2017, 11:58 PM
I wouldnt change him so much I actually love his kit and I dont understand why people wanna change that. But Grover has two heals, so he should be viable as a main healer like Ying or Damba. Right now it is quite risky to heal with him, because his rampant blooming heal is not enough, you are better off with another healer. He is good as a second healer though, because his damage and cc build has its niches, even in tournaments.

Reduce cd on heal by 2 seconds
and/or Passive heal from 80 to 100

=> He is countered by cauterize, at least he should heal a bit more before it comes online.

Rampant blooming now also increases the passive heal to 150-200.

=> Buff his unused legendary, making him a stronger healer without buffing his other builds. Cauterize still destroys him, but the early game would be easier with more heal.

With these changes he might be viable as a main healer, while getting only a small buff to his other builds. He is tanky, so he shouldnt be buffed too hard.

Ironmonger42
05-18-2017, 09:19 AM
Are you seriously nerfing him? He's already the worst support on the meta due to having low damage output and a huge cooldown on a mere 1000 HP healing, and you want to nerf him? People have been asking for buffs for ages, and then I end up reading this...

The only thing I agree with in this thread is the allies glowing for you in Blossom, that would be useful.

My suggestions:

His axes' speed is increased by 10%
Blossom - Cooldown reduced from 12 to 10 seconds, passive heal increased from 80 to 100 per second
Deep roots - No longer prevents targets from being pulled or knocked back (this is more of a bug fix than a buff)
Rampant blooming - Extra healing increased from 160 to 200 per second during 4s
Ferocity - Now also increases axes' speed by 30%

Nerfing Grover the way you want to is like increasing Lex damage by 50%, it's madness

First off, none of this is a nerf.

1. His primary fire rarely does 500 even with bonus damage. This would make him both stronger and more consistant.
2. His is actually a buff to his cooldown. With the correct card, if he heals 2 allies and not just 1, he can heal more often than before, thus a buff if played right.
3. The biggest problem with his ultimate is that cauterize 3 almost completely negates all of it. With this change, it's a buff. He does 500 less healing per second, yes, but now cauterize can't negate more than half of that. That means if the enemy has cauterize 3, he will still do 1000 healing, not 250...

The ENTIRE point of this was to:
1. Make Grover more consistent
2. Give Grover a player style that's unique: A.K.A. stick close to allies and be a mobile healing totem.

THIS IS NOT A NERF. If you think it is, please tell me EXACTLY how this makes him weaker?

dreadz211
05-18-2017, 09:42 AM
No, pls don't change his lmb it is fine as it is. The reason for it has gradual increase damage per distance is that it discourages enemy teams from shoulder shot or poke shot your team.

Ironmonger42
05-18-2017, 10:45 AM
No, pls don't change his lmb it is fine as it is. The reason for it has gradual increase damage per distance is that it discourages enemy teams from shoulder shot or poke shot your team.

that may be true, but 1. Grover can chose to bring it back more powerful than before with Ferocity and 2. it travels so slow that champions like Kinessa can easily time their shots so that they almost never get hit

XxBodeFucetaxX
05-18-2017, 01:38 PM
He's fine on everything, except his healing.

i would buff him by making his Q imune to Cauterize.

So, cooldown would still be high, it would still keep healing 1k, but it would not get useless if players get cauterize.

well, his ult would still get affected by caut, tho.

EpplZ
05-18-2017, 02:05 PM
First off, none of this is a nerf.

1. His primary fire rarely does 500 even with bonus damage. This would make him both stronger and more consistant.


That is because you play him wrong tho, potshots with grover are very usefull against the backline, use vine to get in / Heal / out and you'll be fine, I do agree he's pretty weak and pretty niche based champion tho, but I dont feel like he's lacking in the damage compartment when played right : i.e : at mid to long distance.

Ironmonger42
05-18-2017, 07:00 PM
The big problem I have with him at the moment is that he doesn't feel holistic. If he had a long range heal or a close range weapon, he'd feel holistic, but as I'm trying to not entirely rework him, I thought making it less contradictory would be a possible option.

I don't think making his heal immune to cauterize is a good idea. On the other hand, I did propose the idea of his ultimate having a "minimum healing" aspect. This is because his ultimate is possibly one of the worst late game ultimates for the sole reason that it can't save anyone under the effect of cauterize 3. I don't think any normal ability should be immune to anti-healing, but ultimates, now those are another story

JohnnyBoi3231x
05-26-2017, 12:09 PM
Make his passive heal more or nerf caut.