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View Full Version : Main Torvald. Any thoughts on his Hyper Beam negating Dragon Punch?



foxyfurcoat
05-13-2017, 08:36 AM
I don't have many complaints as a Torvald main. However my main reoccurring complaint is that I am the single prioritized receiver of Drogoz's Dragon Punch. I get it, it makes total sense that I would be prioritized. However, yesterday I predicted the enemy Drogoz's activation when he was directly in front of me about 5 or 6 character lengths away. He pops his Dragon Punch, and I naturally pop my Hyper Beam assuming it would be strong enough to keep him at a distance from my team before his ability timed out.

I was wrong. And it has had me frustrated ever since. As I am constantly prioritized with Dragon Punch and there is just nothing I can do about it. The way I see it, some people might say "well nothing shields from Hyper Beam, so why should anything shield from Dragon Punch?" My response to this is that the chances that my positioning would be correct to negate his Dragon Punch AND kill him is very unlikely. But as a Torvald main, I would just like an option. An available defense against this ultimate if I decide to save my ultimate to combat it.

For example. If Drogoz pops it and heads at me, if I can press him into a wall until his deactivates then we have both sacrificed our ultimates to do so. At this rate, it seems fair. It would also require Drogoz players to note positioning when targeting a Torvald with this, as the wrong position could result in a wasted ultimate as well as a kill for Torvald.

Thanks for reading.

Any feedback on these thought?

Fyrefox45
05-13-2017, 08:38 AM
Making drogoz not immune to CC for dragon punch would be extremely annoying. Torv certainly needs lots of buffs but I'm not really sure this is the right direction to go.

foxyfurcoat
05-13-2017, 08:43 AM
Im not suggesting that they open all the doors. But taking Hyper Beam for example, it works great as a negate for that ability. My suggestion is that if two ults can cancel each other out, why not allow them to do so? For instance, a few rounds ago Makoa was on the point. He popped his ult, which I followed with mine to press him off of the map. I feel giving the option to the Torvald player to attempt to do something about Dragon Punch if he feels it would be a good use of his Hyper Beam would be beneficial. However, this would only work if the Torvald player can get activate and aim with precision. It would by no means be an easy task to accomplish to negate Dragon Punch.

Nexecute
05-13-2017, 08:44 AM
The idea of holding back Dragon Punch with Hyper Beam sounds alright. Ult for an ult. Drogoz could still charge in all directions. Torvald would need to do some tracking. Not much, but still some.

Fyrefox45
05-13-2017, 09:07 AM
I'm not saying it's not a neat idea. Right now though you're either CC immune or you're not during your ult, except for Pips ult going through everything because it's not CC. So they'd have to change Torvs ult to behave like Pips, where it ignores all cc resistance (probably too much), remove drogoz cc immunity and see him constantly stunned out of it, or code in a whole new thing into their patchwork combat system, which always invites more trouble than it's worth with the 3 man QA team they're running.

Thales3002
05-13-2017, 09:41 AM
It would be even cooler if Drogoz weren't able to OHKO, with little counterplay, the enemy's tank every 2 minutes

RogueRifler
05-13-2017, 10:56 AM
The answer is probably that Drogoz needs a different ultimate. Removing Drogoz's CC immunity would cause a lot of weird things to happen since the ability is channeled. What happens when he hit by Evil Mojo? If it is consistent with Grover's interaction he should be a flying chicken that one shots people. What happens when he is hooked? What happens when he is disarmed? The punch should change as Torvald dies whenever a Drogoz ults, there's literally nothing he can do except position himself so that his team can get the trade kill.

SnowzStormz
05-13-2017, 12:59 PM
I would like to see drogoz ult have less control like bk's ult.

Arcana17
05-13-2017, 01:28 PM
While the Drogoz Ult is designed to take out tanks?

XxBodeFucetaxX
05-13-2017, 01:59 PM
The answer is probably that Drogoz needs a different ultimate. Removing Drogoz's CC immunity would cause a lot of weird things to happen since the ability is channeled. What happens when he hit by Evil Mojo? If it is consistent with Grover's interaction he should be a flying chicken that one shots people. What happens when he is hooked? What happens when he is disarmed? The punch should change as Torvald dies whenever a Drogoz ults, there's literally nothing he can do except position himself so that his team can get the trade kill.

Drogoz' ult is fine.
He opens up his guard, needs to hit his target, is vulnerable to damage.
Drogoz needs to be countered (Ying's clones, Fernando's ult, Ruckus ult, Ruckus dodges, BK's ult, any mobile champ, Seris' Travel, Inara's wall, etc.)

GermanGarbage
05-13-2017, 01:59 PM
"well nothing shields from Hyper Beam, so why should anything shield from Dragon Punch?"

Inara's Wall

Grohk's Ghost Walk

Androxus' Nether Step

Seris' Shadow Travel

Evie's Blink / Ice Block

Bomb King's Poppy Bomb

...

There are plenty ways to avoid getting killed by these ults.

But as I said before, Drogoz' ult is still the cheapest way of getting kills. Sometimes I can dodge it by jumping around and have him circling around me until the ult is over, or he has such low health that I can kill him first.

Fyrefox45
05-13-2017, 02:05 PM
Lex's ult is cheesier than Drogoz's.

QcDiablo
05-13-2017, 04:40 PM
[...] except for Pips ult going through everything because it's not CC./QUOTE]

Pip's ult is actually CC. It's just superior CC.

Cassie's ult gives her superior CC immunity, so chicken immunity.

[QUOTE=SnowzStormz;249479]I would like to see drogoz ult have less control like bk's ult.

It used to be like that (different of course though).
Drogoz turned very slowly during his ultimate, he was able to turn a corner for example, and he always got stuck in walls.

It's wasn't that good. Maybe something in between?

GermanGarbage
05-13-2017, 05:20 PM
Lex's ult is cheesier than Drogoz's.

Lex' ult requires people to be below a certain health threshold. Drogoz' ult is a guaranteed kill if it hits.

foxyfurcoat
05-13-2017, 05:59 PM
I would like to see drogoz ult have less control like bk's ult.

I have had Drogoz players chase me around a heavy-angled corner as if they are attached to the wall.

I myself haven't gotten to Drogoz yet, because I have so much fun playing the champions I currently am learning.

Drogoz players, can you 180 on a dime? Is his mobility during this channel really that unrestricted?

FromWitchSide
05-13-2017, 07:27 PM
For example. If Drogoz pops it and heads at me, if I can press him into a wall until his deactivates then we have both sacrificed our ultimates to do so. At this rate, it seems fair. It would also require Drogoz players to note positioning when targeting a Torvald with this, as the wrong position could result in a wasted ultimate as well as a kill for Torvald.Drogoz can say the same. If Torvald is the first one ulting then for Drogoz his ult is the only way to survive.

Considering how many enemies Torvald can kill with one good ult and survive, how Drogoz can get only one enemy and is easily killed while and after using his ult, I would say it is better for Drogoz to counter Torvald.


Drogoz players, can you 180 on a dime? Is his mobility during this channel really that unrestricted?You can turn very sharply, but due to change in camera it is easy to loose track of your target. Often if you have to turn back you wont have much time to really see your enemy, and just fly where you think he should be.

Rinslet
05-14-2017, 05:04 AM
Making drogoz not immune to CC for dragon punch would be extremely annoying.

He will be fine. At leats much more than Makoa who now can swallow all CCs while using his ult.

MarKr
05-14-2017, 06:58 AM
Inara's Wall

Grohk's Ghost Walk

Androxus' Nether Step

Seris' Shadow Travel

Evie's Blink / Ice Block

Bomb King's Poppy Bomb

...

There are plenty ways to avoid getting killed by these ults.

But as I said before, Drogoz' ult is still the cheapest way of getting kills. Sometimes I can dodge it by jumping around and have him circling around me until the ult is over, or he has such low health that I can kill him first.The discussion is mostly about Drogoz vs FL scenarios out of which then only "Inara's wall" and "Ice block" can count as an argument and even those are not very good arguments - Inara's wall can only shield you in specific situations when you place it somewhere and completely block Drogoz' approach to you, when you place it somewhere more "in the open" he always goes over or around the wall and directly after you. I managed to use the wall, block his view and "hide" behind a corner about two times but usually Inara is so slow and that she cannot get out fast enough. Evie's Iceblock can be used only if your Evie is fast enough to jump between Drogoz and FL and activate her Iceblock - but really, how many times did you see that happen?

HiRez said that there are two types of CC - one applied by "normal abilities" (e.g. Damba's reload stun or Pip's rightmouse slow) and the other applied by Utimates. So if Drogoz kept his Immunity to the normal CC but would become volnerable to the "Ulti CC" then it would be "Ultimate for Ultimate" as someone mentioned here before. What is wrong about that? Right now when you play Inara or Torvald and hear Drogoz using his Ultimate you can take your hands off of the keyboard and wait for respawn because you have no "F" skill to quickly get out of view and your movement is so slow that with your normal speed you cannot get away either. Fernando can use his Ult to surive but his Ultimate is definately not ready every 2 minutes as Drogoz' so you cannot counter Drogoz all the time. Ruckus can kill Drogoz with his Ult but Drogoz would need to fly on a straight line towards Ruckus for some time and experienced players never do that - they start the Ultimate somewhere behind corner and then just come so fast that you cannot even properly react. As Barik you can only hope that Drogoz is low on HP and your turrets kill him before he reaches you (which usually also doesn't happen). This way you could sacrifice your Ultimate as Inara or Torvald to cancel out Drogoz.

I can understan that Drogoz is meant to be "bane of FLs" but this is ridiculous - fast recharge, CC immunity, high speed and one-hit-kill any target.
Also the game should always have some counter to everything - if Drogoz is hard counter to FLs, who is hard counter to Drogoz? (And notice that Drogoz is hard counter to all 5 FLs and I am asking who is a hard counter to a single champ)

XxBodeFucetaxX
05-14-2017, 07:45 AM
The discussion is mostly about Drogoz vs FL scenarios out of which then only "Inara's wall" and "Ice block" can count as an argument and even those are not very good arguments - Inara's wall can only shield you in specific situations when you place it somewhere and completely block Drogoz' approach to you, when you place it somewhere more "in the open" he always goes over or around the wall and directly after you. I managed to use the wall, block his view and "hide" behind a corner about two times but usually Inara is so slow and that she cannot get out fast enough. Evie's Iceblock can be used only if your Evie is fast enough to jump between Drogoz and FL and activate her Iceblock - but really, how many times did you see that happen?

HiRez said that there are two types of CC - one applied by "normal abilities" (e.g. Damba's reload stun or Pip's rightmouse slow) and the other applied by Utimates. So if Drogoz kept his Immunity to the normal CC but would become volnerable to the "Ulti CC" then it would be "Ultimate for Ultimate" as someone mentioned here before. What is wrong about that? Right now when you play Inara or Torvald and hear Drogoz using his Ultimate you can take your hands off of the keyboard and wait for respawn because you have no "F" skill to quickly get out of view and your movement is so slow that with your normal speed you cannot get away either. Fernando can use his Ult to surive but his Ultimate is definately not ready every 2 minutes as Drogoz' so you cannot counter Drogoz all the time. Ruckus can kill Drogoz with his Ult but Drogoz would need to fly on a straight line towards Ruckus for some time and experienced players never do that - they start the Ultimate somewhere behind corner and then just come so fast that you cannot even properly react. As Barik you can only hope that Drogoz is low on HP and your turrets kill him before he reaches you (which usually also doesn't happen). This way you could sacrifice your Ultimate as Inara or Torvald to cancel out Drogoz.

I can understan that Drogoz is meant to be "bane of FLs" but this is ridiculous - fast recharge, CC immunity, high speed and one-hit-kill any target.
Also the game should always have some counter to everything - if Drogoz is hard counter to FLs, who is hard counter to Drogoz? (And notice that Drogoz is hard counter to all 5 FLs and I am asking who is a hard counter to a single champ)

The game doesn't work by going "ultimate for ultimate", there are champs mechanics that counter others, (like Willo's dead zone countering Grover's ult, Grohk's totem countering Torvald's, Pip's, BK's ult).
Like i stated earlier, there are many, many ways to counter his ult.
Do you expect to place Inara's wall and hide behind it? you need to be smart...

MarKr
05-14-2017, 07:56 AM
The game doesn't work by going "ultimate for ultimate", there are champs mechanics that counter others, (like Willo's dead zone countering Grover's ult, Grohk's totem countering Torvald's, Pip's, BK's ult).
Like i stated earlier, there are many, many ways to counter his ult.
Do you expect to place Inara's wall and hide behind it? you need to be smart...
Except for the fact that you can counter Grover's ultimate with Cauterize which doesn't even need special ability, only left mouse click. Grohk's totem provides CC immunity only to the "basic CC" so Pip can still turn you to chicken and Torvald shoots you off map.

And I always like to learn...so how exactely do you counter Drogoz' Ult with Inara's wall? Unless you can put the wall somewhere where it blocks him off completely (meaning that he cannot go around it or over it but needs to take some detour which consumes his Ult time) then he simply goes around or over it - you cannot hide because Inara is slow as hell and has no movement ability. I guess you could use the wall underneath you with the knock up card but even that doesn't work every time.
And as I stated before - Drogoz goes mainly after FLs (because others have their escape abilities so when they escape, who remains there to target? right, FLs) so which are some of the "many many ways to counter his Ult" with FLs? Except for Fernando's Ult?

GermanGarbage
05-14-2017, 08:31 AM
The discussion is mostly about Drogoz vs FL scenarios out of which then only "Inara's wall" and "Ice block" can count as an argument and even those are not very good arguments - Inara's wall can only shield you in specific situations when you place it somewhere and completely block Drogoz' approach to you, when you place it somewhere more "in the open" he always goes over or around the wall and directly after you. I managed to use the wall, block his view and "hide" behind a corner about two times but usually Inara is so slow and that she cannot get out fast enough. Evie's Iceblock can be used only if your Evie is fast enough to jump between Drogoz and FL and activate her Iceblock - but really, how many times did you see that happen?

HiRez said that there are two types of CC - one applied by "normal abilities" (e.g. Damba's reload stun or Pip's rightmouse slow) and the other applied by Utimates. So if Drogoz kept his Immunity to the normal CC but would become volnerable to the "Ulti CC" then it would be "Ultimate for Ultimate" as someone mentioned here before. What is wrong about that? Right now when you play Inara or Torvald and hear Drogoz using his Ultimate you can take your hands off of the keyboard and wait for respawn because you have no "F" skill to quickly get out of view and your movement is so slow that with your normal speed you cannot get away either. Fernando can use his Ult to surive but his Ultimate is definately not ready every 2 minutes as Drogoz' so you cannot counter Drogoz all the time. Ruckus can kill Drogoz with his Ult but Drogoz would need to fly on a straight line towards Ruckus for some time and experienced players never do that - they start the Ultimate somewhere behind corner and then just come so fast that you cannot even properly react. As Barik you can only hope that Drogoz is low on HP and your turrets kill him before he reaches you (which usually also doesn't happen). This way you could sacrifice your Ultimate as Inara or Torvald to cancel out Drogoz.

I can understan that Drogoz is meant to be "bane of FLs" but this is ridiculous - fast recharge, CC immunity, high speed and one-hit-kill any target.
Also the game should always have some counter to everything - if Drogoz is hard counter to FLs, who is hard counter to Drogoz? (And notice that Drogoz is hard counter to all 5 FLs and I am asking who is a hard counter to a single champ)

Trading one ultimate for the other is a fair thing. I wanna be able to counter Drogoz and BK with Inara, although I'm always feeling that evil satisfaction when countering Makoa's ult - because keep in mind that Inara's ult charges a lot faster so if you're smart, you'll always save it to counter Makoa.

As for a hard counter, I'd say Androxus is the one you're looking for.

His ability to fly allows him to chase Drogoz through the air and makes him a hard target for rockets. Usually it's even so that I'm still in the air while Drogoz was already back at the ground, giving me the opportunity to easily headshot him.

And even if I miss all my shots - I'm still distracting him from what he's supposed to do: Killing tanks.

He can't ignore Androxus as that would eventually kill him.

The only real annoyance about Drogoz is, when he hides between his team mates. That makes him unreachable for Androxus.

GermanGarbage
05-14-2017, 08:34 AM
Except for the fact that you can counter Grover's ultimate with Cauterize which doesn't even need special ability, only left mouse click. Grohk's totem provides CC immunity only to the "basic CC" so Pip can still turn you to chicken and Torvald shoots you off map.

Grohk's totem has prevented my team on many occasions from getting sucked into Seris' ult, so I don't know if you can really say it just provides CC immunity to basic CC.

I'll have to investigate this further in order to figure out if this goes for other ults as well, admittedly.

Rhaenxys
05-14-2017, 08:41 AM
I think they need to consider how drogoz ult works against inara and torvald, for those two tanks, there is no counterplay at all and thats very bad for gameplay.

Drogoz ult shouldnt have CC immunity considering how fast he goes, inara could stop him with warden field and her ult and torvald would have the option to use his ult on drogoz.

GermanGarbage
05-14-2017, 08:42 AM
He will be fine. At leats much more than Makoa who now can swallow all CCs while using his ult.

I think Makoa's ult should give him at least immunity to basic CC.

I've counter-ulted him with Pip, Bomb King, Mal'Damba and Inara so many times that it's not even funny and I felt a little bit bad for those players when doing it.

I won't stop doing it, simply because of tactical advantage and I don't want my team mates to get hooked into his deadly punches.

But I also feel bad for him everytime he gets counter-ulted, especially when Pip is the one counter-ulting him.

GermanGarbage
05-14-2017, 08:45 AM
I think they need to consider how drogoz ult works against inara and torvald, for those two tanks, there is no counterplay at all and thats very bad for gameplay.

Drogoz ult shouldnt have CC immunity considering how fast he goes, inara could stop him with warden field and her ult and torvald would have the option to use his ult on drogoz.

Holy shit, no. That would make his ult completely useless. I always play Inara with Treachorous Ground, which gets many enemies killed because you can't dodge or escape it. It turns Warden Field into Evie's ult with an 8 s cooldown.

Fyrefox45
05-14-2017, 10:18 AM
Grohk's totem has prevented my team on many occasions from getting sucked into Seris' ult, so I don't know if you can really say it just provides CC immunity to basic CC.

I'll have to investigate this further in order to figure out if this goes for other ults as well, admittedly.

Grohks totem with the legendary stops everything except chickens, for sure.

Rhaenxys
05-14-2017, 11:31 AM
Holy shit, no. That would make his ult completely useless. I always play Inara with Treachorous Ground, which gets many enemies killed because you can't dodge or escape it. It turns Warden Field into Evie's ult with an 8 s cooldown.

She sacrifices a lot of sustain with treacherous ground, even more with the OB50 buff, the ability without the card would only slowdown drogoz, with or without the legendary card he still can attack Inara from above with the ult.

MarKr
05-14-2017, 11:36 AM
OK, I am not really sure which effects are considered "basic CC" and which "über CC"...I would say that Fyrefox45 is right and totem does not stop Pip's Ultimate, but I would have sworn that Torvald shot me with his Ult off of point where I had my totem deployed...It would be nice to have some list wich would tell people which abilities provide which type of CC.

Anyway - Drogoz should keep his CC immunity to the basic CC otherwise his Ult will be like Makoa's now, only difference would be that Makoa has crap load of HP while Drogoz has 2500 so he would die easily to anything.

GermanGarbage
05-14-2017, 01:46 PM
She sacrifices a lot of sustain with treacherous ground, even more with the OB50 buff, the ability without the card would only slowdown drogoz, with or without the legendary card he still can attack Inara from above with the ult.

Good point, but I rarely see people do that, even in Competitive.

Most people prefer to linger around the next corner, which I understand. Because often Drogoz gets killed when trying to ult from above.

GermanGarbage
05-14-2017, 01:48 PM
She sacrifices a lot of sustain with treacherous ground, even more with the OB50 buff, the ability without the card would only slowdown drogoz, with or without the legendary card he still can attack Inara from above with the ult.

I pick that card because it provides the most help to my team. I expect my healer to take care of my sustain.

I also play Inara always with Kill to Heal, which makes her very hard to kill inside a competent team.

FromWitchSide
05-14-2017, 06:30 PM
It is not a duel game.
If it would be just a duel tank vs Drogoz, then Drogoz can kill a tank without using ultimate.

Drogoz has to hide to use his ultimate, keep track of his target, avoid clones and turrets, survive while flying, and even then survive after getting that kill. It is not an ultimate you use very often if your enemies are any good.

XxBodeFucetaxX
05-14-2017, 08:18 PM
Except for the fact that you can counter Grover's ultimate with Cauterize which doesn't even need special ability, only left mouse click. Grohk's totem provides CC immunity only to the "basic CC" so Pip can still turn you to chicken and Torvald shoots you off map.

And I always like to learn...so how exactely do you counter Drogoz' Ult with Inara's wall? Unless you can put the wall somewhere where it blocks him off completely (meaning that he cannot go around it or over it but needs to take some detour which consumes his Ult time) then he simply goes around or over it - you cannot hide because Inara is slow as hell and has no movement ability. I guess you could use the wall underneath you with the knock up card but even that doesn't work every time.
And as I stated before - Drogoz goes mainly after FLs (because others have their escape abilities so when they escape, who remains there to target? right, FLs) so which are some of the "many many ways to counter his Ult" with FLs? Except for Fernando's Ult?

It may not work against Pip's ult. but it do work against Torvald, BK, Seris, etc.
I tested it, and it works...

About contering Drogoz' Ult... Pick Ruckus...

MarKr
05-15-2017, 03:28 AM
It may not work against Pip's ult. but it do work against Torvald, BK, Seris, etc.
I tested it, and it works...OK...as I said I would have sworn that Torvald shot me off of point with my totem deployed, but I guess I was wrong...


About contering Drogoz' Ult... Pick Ruckus...That was...very detailed hint. OK, so what can Ruckus do?
1) Use his main attack and kill Drogoz before he reaches you
2) Use Ultimate to kill Drogoz before he reaches you
- these are hard to do because Drogoz would need to start his Ult far from you (or closer with low HP) and fly on a straight line towards you - NOBODY who is half-decent with Drogoz does this; they start the Ult safe behind a corner (and usually with at least 3/4 of HP) and then come so fast that you cannot kill them fast enough
3) Use "F" ability and try to dodge Drogoz...might work but you need to pray that he doen't make a turn and doesn't hit you then; yes, you can dodge twice but this method is, I would say, not really reliable

So...that is 3 ways to counter Drogoz' Ultimate which are all on Ruckus. We can make it 4 ways to counter Drogoz' Ultimate if we count Fernando's Ultimate, rest of FLs have nothing...we should let know the guys who make Oxford Dictionary that the phrase "many, many" from now on means "4" :D

XxBodeFucetaxX
05-15-2017, 05:51 AM
OK...as I said I would have sworn that Torvald shot me off of point with my totem deployed, but I guess I was wrong...

That was...very detailed hint. OK, so what can Ruckus do?
1) Use his main attack and kill Drogoz before he reaches you
2) Use Ultimate to kill Drogoz before he reaches you
- these are hard to do because Drogoz would need to start his Ult far from you (or closer with low HP) and fly on a straight line towards you - NOBODY who is half-decent with Drogoz does this; they start the Ult safe behind a corner (and usually with at least 3/4 of HP) and then come so fast that you cannot kill them fast enough
3) Use "F" ability and try to dodge Drogoz...might work but you need to pray that he doen't make a turn and doesn't hit you then; yes, you can dodge twice but this method is, I would say, not really reliable

So...that is 3 ways to counter Drogoz' Ultimate which are all on Ruckus. We can make it 4 ways to counter Drogoz' Ultimate if we count Fernando's Ultimate, rest of FLs have nothing...we should let know the guys who make Oxford Dictionary that the phrase "many, many" from now on means "4" :D

Drogoz usually go in a straight line to kill Ruckus, which make easier to land every single bullet.
Also, fash backward to get more time while shooting him, you don't even need to ult. Ult and it will be a lot easier.

Dash upwards (legendary card) and you can avoid him.

those 2 ways works very well.

AmsterdamHeavy
05-15-2017, 09:29 AM
Starting to think Morale Boost is the actual problem, not the ultimate mechanics or the rock/paper/scissor element. The only reason this is really an issue is frequency, because with MB, Drogoz can ultimate every few minutes easily, as long as hes been doing damage and that isnt exactly hard.

I can say the same thing about Torvald; the frequency he can put down ultimates and wipe whole teams is over the top. Reduce the effectiveness of Morale Boost and these "problems" go away.

MadEngineer
05-15-2017, 09:34 AM
I think instead of instakill, Drogoz's ult should do exactly 100% of the enemy's health (including shields) BUT should be mitigated by Haven AND Blast Shield.


Starting to think Morale Boost is the actual problem, not the ultimate mechanics or the rock/paper/scissor element. The only reason this is really an issue is frequency, because with MB, Drogoz can ultimate every few minutes easily, as long as hes been doing damage and that isnt exactly hard.

I can say the same thing about Torvald; the frequency he can put down ultimates and wipe whole teams is over the top. Reduce the effectiveness of Morale Boost and these "problems" go away.

Also this ^

Roborstje
05-25-2017, 11:50 AM
Was thinking the same thing, and btw, evie can easily survive torvald's hyper beam, her soar is strong enough and she can still blink out

WarMongger
05-26-2017, 06:38 AM
I don't have many complaints as a Torvald main. However my main reoccurring complaint is that I am the single prioritized receiver of Drogoz's Dragon Punch. I get it, it makes total sense that I would be prioritized. However, yesterday I predicted the enemy Drogoz's activation when he was directly in front of me about 5 or 6 character lengths away. He pops his Dragon Punch, and I naturally pop my Hyper Beam assuming it would be strong enough to keep him at a distance from my team before his ability timed out.

I was wrong. And it has had me frustrated ever since. As I am constantly prioritized with Dragon Punch and there is just nothing I can do about it. The way I see it, some people might say "well nothing shields from Hyper Beam, so why should anything shield from Dragon Punch?" My response to this is that the chances that my positioning would be correct to negate his Dragon Punch AND kill him is very unlikely. But as a Torvald main, I would just like an option. An available defense against this ultimate if I decide to save my ultimate to combat it.

For example. If Drogoz pops it and heads at me, if I can press him into a wall until his deactivates then we have both sacrificed our ultimates to do so. At this rate, it seems fair. It would also require Drogoz players to note positioning when targeting a Torvald with this, as the wrong position could result in a wasted ultimate as well as a kill for Torvald.

Thanks for reading.

Any feedback on these thought?

http://oi64.tinypic.com/nbw6xf.jpg

as a tovold main my tip for is very simple tell your team to fire on drogoz even his ulting its not hard just to tell them that or ask one of them to human shield them self
when a drogoz ult my tank i just did the get down Mr.prsident block just to save tank

AmsterdamHeavy
05-26-2017, 10:50 AM
OK, I am not really sure which effects are considered "basic CC" and which "über CC"...I would say that Fyrefox45 is right and totem does not stop Pip's Ultimate, but I would have sworn that Torvald shot me with his Ult off of point where I had my totem deployed...It would be nice to have some list wich would tell people which abilities provide which type of CC.

Anyway - Drogoz should keep his CC immunity to the basic CC otherwise his Ult will be like Makoa's now, only difference would be that Makoa has crap load of HP while Drogoz has 2500 so he would die easily to anything.

The Legendary only provides 2 seconds of CC protection when the totem is dropped (while everyone is gold).

As aside, I find a pretty good way to stymie Drogoz's Ult is....drumroll....as Skye.

Ya, well, I know. But, whenever I am around and playing Skye, if i see a Drogoz ult, I just go for him and get in front of him and let him waste it on me. I mean, whats more useless than using that ult on a Skye?