PDA

View Full Version : Inara is severely underpowered.



Rhaenxys
03-04-2017, 03:47 AM
I just tried Inara on PTS and personal opinion here but her ability to sustain damage isnt enough for a character with the same mobility as torvald and without a mobile shield, here are my suggestions:

- Reduce the cooldown on earthen guard to 10 seconds, raise the damage reduction to 40%.
- Raise the cooldown on impasse to 15 seconds, however the cooldown starts when the ability is deployed, same goes for warder`s field.

- There are two healing cards, one for earthen guard and the other one for warder`s field, they go for 20 heal per second each level, this is not enough to sustain herself, considering her mobility and impasse cannot be moved like other shields, those healing cards should heal for something between 40-50 per second each level.

While not a high priority thing, her weapon may need a little bit more damage, as it only does 25 more damage as makoa shot but in a burst, it should deal 250 per shot, considering most of the time against medium mobility champions you only hit 2 shots.

SlenderLegs
03-04-2017, 04:18 AM
I think you meant that the ability will go on cooldown once its deployed. Impasse is already weak, it doesnt need a higher cooldown. And i highly agree that she her healing cards needs to be buffed. 20 heal per second is NOTHING

Rhaenxys
03-04-2017, 04:27 AM
Impasse actually has 14 second cooldown and last 5 seconds, thats why i suggest a 1 second raise to 15, because is a bit more balanced considering her legendary card too, we dont want impasse spam.

Rencalcifer
03-04-2017, 06:19 AM
I would like to w8 to play Inara like then newly nerfed (fuck yea) Maeve to complain if it's underpowered or if Maeve's nerf have being like those nerfs to hell like Blizzard does.

Thales3002
03-04-2017, 08:36 AM
I think she's fine, there's already a legendary that reduces the wall cooldown by 7 seconds (it's almost half). The only thing I would like to be buffed is her ultimate, it should deal more damage or stun for longer, it just seems like a Grumpy Bomb.

Drathahasu
03-04-2017, 08:44 AM
Since most of the maps are quite open, then I think Inara will be worst pick for fronties. I can see so many ways to counter her (for example, pure damage, pure speed) and she doesn't have any proper abilities to defend herself while being mobile.

Migrayne
03-04-2017, 09:32 AM
Looking at Her on PTS she does seem kind of weak for a front line. The wall is a different idea, but kind of useless compared to a shield that you can still shoot through.
She has no way to really defend anyone else on her team let alone her self. She has no mobility at all.
The wall will have limited uses since the enemy will heal up on the other side of it and you can't shoot at them either. The 30% damage mitigation seems kind of weak compared to an actual shield that others on your team can hide behind as well.

Wambo24
03-04-2017, 09:37 AM
i rather see a weak new champion that gets slowly buffed up till it hits critical mass ( by that i mean people play the champion but its not a autopick ) rather than what we had with meave last patch.
gj on that hi rez

Rhaenxys
03-04-2017, 10:00 AM
I think she's fine, there's already a legendary that reduces the wall cooldown by 7 seconds (it's almost half). The only thing I would like to be buffed is her ultimate, it should deal more damage or stun for longer, it just seems like a Grumpy Bomb.

Impasse is not the problem, the problem is mostly earthen guard damage reduction value, which is not enough and the low amount of healing with the cards, torvald trades mobility for high survivability, Inara`s survivability isnt on par with her mobility.

Also, the cooldown on the deployables should start when they are deployed, as every deployable in the game, the impasse legendary card is pretty much a band aid for that huge cooldown.

Z1R0
03-04-2017, 10:07 AM
i rather see a weak new champion that gets slowly buffed up till it hits critical mass ( by that i mean people play the champion but its not a autopick ) rather than what we had with meave last patch.
gj on that hi rez

My thoughts exactly!

To OP - remember Inara is a frontline meant to be a CC of sorts. more to control the field then be a pure tank.
yet I didn't play her so your feedback is good.

tymandude1
03-04-2017, 01:04 PM
Yeah I kind feel like it might even be a bug that her shit doesn't go on cooldown immediatly because no other deployable works this way and makes her CDs insanely long. You feel punished for actively keeping these things alive.

Her Legendaries are pretty plain Jane too with exception to the cripple one. I think cooler things could be done with the other two to make them more interesting.

Huttmunkkeeeys
03-04-2017, 01:44 PM
I have 3 problems with Inara. Firstly, her Warder's Field ability should have a card that increases the range of it. The ability seems a bit underwelming as it only affect champions close to her. Having a card that increases the range could make for some interesting loadouts.

Secondly, her self heal cards. If you look at other frontlines like Makoa, Fernando, and Ruckus, they have relatively powerful heal cards. This is why I think her heal heal cards should be buffed up to 50/100/150/200.

Lastly, her ult. It's basically a glorified Grumpy Bomb minus the damage. What I think it should do is add a mark that does 10% more damage to stunned enemies during the duration, similar to Mal Damba's Ult before OB44.

PrinceWulf
03-04-2017, 02:44 PM
It does feel like that's the case. The way she's designed is great, but she needs a bit more push in some directions, for example:
-be able to completely block path with wall, not increasing the size of wall, but simply not decreasing when it's in narrow path for payload (I mean, it doesn't stay there for ever and cd for it takes 15 sec if I recall and minimum...8?)
-her ultimate dealing more than just around basic damage (I don't think dealing about 800 damage is too much, considering Bomb King's ulti can take about 2000 damage if close to an enemy)

Pixelszz
03-04-2017, 02:56 PM
New team composition: 1 tank 2 sup 1 flank 1 dmg.

Huttmunkkeeeys
03-04-2017, 03:05 PM
-her ultimate dealing more than just around basic damage (I don't think dealing about 800 damage is too much, considering Bomb King's ulti can take about 2000 damage if close to an enemy)

I personally prefer the damage bonus when a character is affected, similar to Mal Damba's Ult. That way it adds a bit of uniqueness instead of being a weaker clone of Bomb King's Grumpy Bomb.

tymandude1
03-04-2017, 03:05 PM
It does feel like that's the case. The way she's designed is great, but she needs a bit more push in some directions, for example:
-be able to completely block path with wall, not increasing the size of wall, but simply not decreasing when it's in narrow path for payload (I mean, it doesn't stay there for ever and cd for it takes 15 sec if I recall and minimum...8?)
-her ultimate dealing more than just around basic damage (I don't think dealing about 800 damage is too much, considering Bomb King's ulti can take about 2000 damage if close to an enemy)

First and foremost she needs her shit to go on cooldown when it's used and not when it dies or times out. This is a huge issue.

CandySuxxx
03-04-2017, 05:32 PM
I think you meant that the ability will go on cooldown once its deployed. Impasse is already weak, it doesnt need a higher cooldown. And i highly agree that she her healing cards needs to be buffed. 20 heal per second is NOTHING

I dont know anything anymore.

Rhaenxys
03-05-2017, 03:04 AM
I've done more testing on PTS, all is subject to my own perspective of balance but this is what i think needs some tweaks:

- The damage fall off in her weapon starts too soon, the shots may need just a little bit more wider hitbox for mobile targets.

- It may seem crazy high but earthen ward should be 50%, even with the talent it cant compete with the degree of protection who offers a shield, impasse is too static to be considered a shield, in open areas it doesnt protect that much.

- Deployables going on cooldown when deployed.

- Healing cards raised to 50/100/150/200.

- A higher minimal amount of damage on her ultimate or (as suggested by other user) a bonus damage on affected targets.

And thats it, is a lot of buffs i know but they are pretty much needed imo and i find them reasonable.

Wattebausch
03-05-2017, 03:25 AM
I dont know what you all know or... "think" a TANK have to do? But... i know a TANK have to save and NOT to damage!!!
So please... let Inara at she is and"LEARN TO PLAY"

MiraKabal
03-05-2017, 05:06 AM
i rather see a weak new champion that gets slowly buffed up till it hits critical mass ( by that i mean people play the champion but its not a autopick ) rather than what we had with meave last patch.
gj on that hi rez

Agreed, an underpowered champion does not affect the meta in any way, simply do not pick them until they are fixed. In fact Hi-Rez should always go this route with new champions: when in doubt, an underpowered new champion is better than an overpowered one.

Mariwak
03-05-2017, 06:34 AM
Inara isnt meant to do damage she is all about controlling the battlefield which means she will suck in casual as you really have to rely on your team to deal the damage while you cc.

Cyanian
03-05-2017, 07:19 AM
In my opinion they should increase the duration of Impasse considerably - or make it last indefinitely until destroyed - and double the length of it for it to really be considered useful in most scenarios. It only lasts five seconds which is not enough time for Bulldozer to even be considered an effective counter - which is obviously the direction they're intending this character to shift the meta toward - especially considering the rather lengthy 15 second cooldown that also doesn't start until after the wall is destroyed or the duration elapses.

It's sort of the same deal with Warder's Field. The radius is far too small and should be doubled but have a slight fall-off near the outer third of the radius. By the time you drop it people are most likely going to already be on the edge of it and on their way. I feel it too should last indefinitely or have a longer duration for the same reasons as Impasse. After all, Hi-Rez want you to pick Bulldozer which I think would be a great change to the meta if it becomes warranted with the introduction of Inara and any other champs that follow suit.

Earthen Guard is interesting because, as people seem to have ignored, the damage reduction isn't affected by Wrecker, unlike all the other champs and abilities it's being compared to. In fact, there is no counter to it at all, so I think it's fine that it's 30% but again it's on a long cooldown. I suppose that would suffice if her other tools were beefed up a bit. I also think it would be a good idea for Earthen Guard to remove all slows upon activation and provide CC immunity for the duration or at the very least slow immunity. Since she has no movement ability she'll be easily countered if she doesn't have some sort of protection from enemy CC. She is after all, an immovable object, no? ;)

I think her ultimate is fine so long as it charges relatively quickly and can be used every two or three minutes if she's constantly in the thick of the fight. It seems rather lackluster at first glance but if she charges it quickly enough then it can be a very powerful tool at her disposal which is countered by Resilience so if it becomes a problem for the enemy team they should know what to do about it.

If she's being designed as a CC-centric front liner then give her the proper tools. Don't half-ass it with a wall that's roughly the size of a single car garage door and what amounts to a Grohk totem that slows people, both with pitiful durations making destroying them a non-consideration because it's more efficient to just kill her or someone else if the opportunity presents itself. If you don't destroy the wall, so what? If the enemy team is on the other side of their wall then they can't hit you either.

In closing, I think her kit in concept is great but poor in execution. Only time will tell how she will shape up. Currently I feel she'll be largely ignored in the competitive scene and that would most certainly be a bloomin' shame considering she's our first ever female front liner!

IAmSleeping
03-05-2017, 07:30 AM
The wall is actually a good tool to separate enemy frontliners from their healers or damage dealers. I wish this wall was wider, so it's not that easy to walk around it.

Idea to make her ult more interesting: Her ult should draw stunned players 20 units closer to the point where the spear was landed.

WarMongger
03-05-2017, 07:41 AM
inara the only tank who cant generate sheild only wall plus the stun 2 sec is fair but the ult dmg need a little boost

Rhaenxys
03-05-2017, 08:09 AM
Yeah earthen guard damage reduction cant be countered by wrecker, whoever shields act like a separate health bar, is pretty much free hitpoints, impasse is not a substitute of a shield, you can jump over it with certain characters or move around of it in certain maps, specially wide maps.

Earthen guard should provide a higher amount of damage reduction in order to help Inara survive in wide areas or when impasse is on cooldown, actually the few problems with Inara is how she trades mobility pretty much for subpar survivability, her healing cards also need to be on par with the other tanks, shield + 50 per sec heals offers better survivability than damage reduction + 20 per sec heals.

Mikeomans
03-05-2017, 09:59 AM
I think a good idea is just to wait and see what the dynamic is like when the update comes out and everyone is using her most.

Insizer
03-05-2017, 07:07 PM
I'd like it if she could detonate her wall and cast her "thumper stone" (I forgot the name) from a distance. But yeah, she doesn't seem like she'll do that good as a FL. Then again, I haven't tried her against anyone seeing as basically no one uses PTS when I'm on.

Huttmunkkeeeys
03-05-2017, 08:28 PM
The reason Impasse is Channeled is so you can throw it down to block a combo or an Ult, but not have it up the entire duration. My suggestion is to keep Impasse channeled, but lower the cooldown to 8-10 seconds, then have her cooldown card turn Impasse into a non channeled ability with a higher cooldown and duration, maybe 15 second cooldown and it lasts 8 seconds. That way it adds more variety in the ways she could be played.

Another problem I have is with her Warder's Field ability, it's near useless since it's cast at her feet. My suggestion is either make it last indefinitely, similar to Barik's Turret, or add a card that allows you to increase the radius of the ability.

Lastly, her damage is fine, but her ult needs a bit of tweaking. In it's current form, it's just a glorified Grumpy Bomb minus the timer and damage. My suggestion is to add a mark to her ult that affects everyone who's stunned. The mark will last for the duration of the stun and will make them receive 20% more damage, similar to Mal Damba's Ult before OB44.

CandySuxxx
03-05-2017, 08:52 PM
She is cool imo, f's radius could be more.

xRevy
03-05-2017, 10:42 PM
I get 100k with her easily all the time I have no problems with her she is a fantastic front line. I would like a card that makes the range of the wall longer however.

WoodenBox
03-05-2017, 11:31 PM
Maybe make the burst go faster for like 3 projectiles each over 0.3 seconds,every 0.8 seconds.
Old one 0.4 - 1 second.

Rhaenxys
03-06-2017, 04:22 AM
They should buff stone bulwark and caretaker, thats top priority imo, it desperately need to heal for 50 per level both cards, a small range buff on warder field and some adjust on the cooldowns and done, i still think the damage reduction from earthen guard is too low and doesnt compensate for the lack of a proper shield and low mobility, at least make it 40%, dunno if they are gonna leave her like in the PTS but i really hope we dont have to wait to OB 46 for changes.

Mariwak
03-06-2017, 09:50 AM
Her troll potential is great though. She can just block off her team from shooting or moving.

Asthonman
10-17-2017, 05:46 PM
what if they made her role more towards area denial? have impasse and warden's field last indefinately, and allow her to place two warden's fields at a time.
the idea is to make her more of a support class, focusing on defense rather than offense.
maybe they could change her wall legendary to make the wall last indefinately and have a shorter cooldown, similar to fernando's shield legendary.
I can see this very usefull for the tavern onslaught map; she and another class get up to the top deck, she casts her impasse over the door preventing enemies from getting in. a support like gronk or grover heals the wall while the damage wrecks anyone who goes down below. a 3 team powerhouse.

xPurplexx
10-17-2017, 06:58 PM
She's been borderline USELESS for some time now.

OzzyOzzy
10-17-2017, 08:08 PM
Nice necro, folks.

https://media.tenor.com/images/11765133580e8ea6600f079ffa3721b2/tenor.gif

Gonna need a moderator to close this.

Mattzby
10-18-2017, 01:41 AM
what if they made her role more towards area denial? have impasse and warden's field last indefinately, and allow her to place two warden's fields at a time.
the idea is to make her more of a support class, focusing on defense rather than offense.
maybe they could change her wall legendary to make the wall last indefinately and have a shorter cooldown, similar to fernando's shield legendary.
I can see this very usefull for the tavern onslaught map; she and another class get up to the top deck, she casts her impasse over the door preventing enemies from getting in. a support like gronk or grover heals the wall while the damage wrecks anyone who goes down below. a 3 team powerhouse.

I think making both of her deploys last infinitely might be too much, but the durations could definitely be improved. She just feels clunky compared to the other tanks, and using the wall feels a lot riskier than just going with a frontliner who uses shields.

I will be interested to see how the new diminishing returns affect Inara, since her damage reduction should see an increase. She is already pretty annoying to get off a point/payload when having somewhat effective heals.



Nice necro, folks.
Gonna need a moderator to close this.

Inara is still pretty underwhelming right? I see her picked far less than most other tanks. So, I would say the point of this thread still stands? Why does the creation date matter if the topic is still relevant? If someone searches and finds a thread already created on the subject, is it not better for them to use an existing thread?

I've seen several threads get picked back up, conversation resumes, then someone points out it was created months ago and it gets closed by a moderator. It's just very odd to me.

xPurplexx
10-18-2017, 07:51 AM
Inara is still pretty underwhelming right? I see her picked far less than most other tanks. So, I would say the point of this thread still stands? Why does the creation date matter if the topic is still relevant? If someone searches and finds a thread already created on the subject, is it not better for them to use an existing thread?

I've seen several threads get picked back up, conversation resumes, then someone points out it was created months ago and it gets closed by a moderator. It's just very odd to me.

Inara's pretty bad right now. She has probably the lowest DPS in the game, no mobility, and abilities with unreasonably long cooldowns.

I agree though. The necro rule here is dumb, because the conversation is still relevant.

Genavelle
10-18-2017, 12:53 PM
Inara is perfectly fine (Although I haven't tried her with OB61). I do perfectly well on her, and pretty sure she's my highest Winrate champion.

Also how do you even find 7 month old threads to necro??

Genavelle
10-18-2017, 01:00 PM
Sorry for double post, but if I try to edit on mobile it just deletes my post.

Inara is balanced and a good example of what a tank SHOULD be. If she seems weak, that's because other frontlines like Fernando and Makoa have been buffed too much and are too strong. Frontlines should not be able to flank, wipe teams, or 1 shot anyone. A frontline typically is a champ with high health and defensive abilities, while having moderate or low damage, and low mobility.

Inara does not need a buff, and I guarantee buffing her because noobs think she's useless WILL ruin her. Inara is in a good place, and if she receives any hefty buffs, then she will become OP. Which will end up with her being badly nerfed and then actually useless.

So let's not fix what isn't broken, right?

EpplZ
10-18-2017, 05:20 PM
Inara is still pretty underwhelming right? I see her picked far less than most other tanks. So, I would say the point of this thread still stands? Why does the creation date matter if the topic is still relevant? If someone searches and finds a thread already created on the subject, is it not better for them to use an existing thread?

I've seen several threads get picked back up, conversation resumes, then someone points out it was created months ago and it gets closed by a moderator. It's just very odd to me.

Thanks! I've been trying to say this the right way since quite some time :

1 - The post is old and irrelevant : close it already, without it being necroed
2 - The post is old but still relevant : why closing it if a person answer? Is it better to have 35000 threads closed threads about the same subject or is it better to keep the number of threads to a minimum?

I dont understand this rule in the first place, not that it bothers me too much tho, but I find it quite paradoxal.

On topic : Inara is strong by her capacity to stall IMO, and because she doesnt use the same mecanics as other tanks, I still dont use her because I cant get accustomed to the "slow when you fire" thingy (to me it breaks the rythm of the champion and I cant aim properly with such a sluggish strafe suddenly) but good inaras are a seriouspain to take down. She's very very reliant on her team tho, if your team can't kill or damage the enemy and she's overwhelmed, she cant do mucho...